Doing 60 in a temp 50 on M4

[Danny54]

So I got caught on the M4 doing 60 (probably from those average speed cameras) in a temporary 50mph section at 2am, no traffic, wide lanes, clear as anything, ABSOLUTELY no danger to myself or anyone whatsoever. Wrote a very polite letter to warwickshire police admitting my fault and asking them to consider a fixed penalty without points bearing in mind how clear the road was but that I leave it entirely in their hands. Of course, they ignored the letter and I've to send £60 and my lovely clean licence to get 3 points. I mean seriously, what is it with these authorities, don't they EVER use discretion? They just bulldoze their way to get their money even when they KNOW there was no danger. It's not like I was doing 80 or 90 which would have been fair cop, and it's not like I was doing 10 mph over the limit in a narrow built up area. It was SIXTY on a goddamn motorway. If you drive on country roads, they allow speed limits FAR more dangerous than what I did. One person who was more angry at this than even me reckoned I should complain to my local MP. But I doubt I have a cat in hells chance of getting anywhere do I?

[crem]

Danny54, you are making that same old mistake that many people do; you have based your thoughts on logic and the assumption that the cameras and speed limit had something to do with safety on that road. Big mistake!

Now rethink the problem and substitute the word "revenue" where you had used "safety" and I think you will realise there is no way you were ever going to get off with this.

[Danny54]

Originally Posted by crem

Danny54, you are making that same old mistake that many people do; you have based your thoughts on logic and the assumption that the cameras and speed limit had something to do with safety on that road. Big mistake!

Now rethink the problem and substitute the word "revenue" where you had used "safety" and I think you will realise there is no way you were ever going to get off with this.

Lol, completely agree.

Ok, I DO think that the increase of speed cameras has decreased road accidents and I generally do feel safer on the roads. But discretion needs to be used instead of blanket fining and giving points to everyone without taking into acount individual cases. Yes, on the whole, it is a money making racket.

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by Danny54

Ok, I DO think that the increase of speed cameras has decreased road accidents and I generally do feel safer on the roads.

No they haven't and there are official TRRL figures to prove this. In fact, their research shows an increase in accidents where cameras are used to enforce a temp 50 mph m-way limit.

But discretion needs to be used instead of blanket fining and giving points to everyone without taking into acount individual cases. Yes, on the whole, it is a money making racket.

There is no discretion within the law. This is not the fault of those enforcing it. You had no chance whatsoever of paying a fine and not getting points - the law mandates penalty points for speeding.

It was SIXTY on a goddamn motorway. If you drive on country roads, they allow speed limits FAR more dangerous than what I did.

Actually, they don't. On single carriagway country roads the highest possible speed limit is 60 mph.

[crem]

Originally Posted by Danny54

It was SIXTY on a goddamn motorway. If you drive on country roads, they allow speed limits FAR more dangerous than what I did.

Originally Posted by patdavies

Actually, they don't. On single carriagway country roads the highest possible speed limit is 60 mph.

pat I think you mis-read Danny's post. He didn't say they allow HIGHER speed limits on country roads, but that the speed limits on country roads are far more dangerous than the 60 he was doing on the motorway under the circumstances he was driving under.

[Danny54]

Originally Posted by patdavies

No they haven't and there are official TRRL figures to prove this. In fact, their research shows an increase in accidents where cameras are used to enforce a temp 50 mph m-way limit.



There is no discretion within the law. This is not the fault of those enforcing it. You had no chance whatsoever of paying a fine and not getting points - the law mandates penalty points for speeding.

Actually, they don't. On single carriagway country roads the highest possible speed limit is 60 mph.

Well even 60mph on a single carriageway country road still has to carry way more potential accident risk than a wide 3 lane motorway with hardly any traffic on it at 2am.

[Danny54]

Originally Posted by crem

pat I think you mis-read Danny's post. He didn't say they allow HIGHER speed limits on country roads, but that the speed limits on country roads are far more dangerous than the 60 he was doing on the motorway under the circumstances he was driving under.

Correct. Though I can see how my sentence could be misinterpreted to mean higher speeds than 60.

[wheelergeezer]

Originally Posted by Danny54

Lol, completely agree.

Ok, I DO think that the increase of speed cameras has decreased road accidents ......

Completely disagree. Money (Speed) cameras simply cause bad drivers to suddenly brake for the camera and then immediately speed up afterwards.

I was travelling south on the A1 between Grantham and Stamford. I was doing exactly 70 in lane 1. I was overtaken by a woman doing approximately 90 when she obviously spotted the fixed money camera. She swerved in front of me and literally slammed the brakes on, I braked to avoid a collison before checking it was safe to overtake her and carry on at 70mph. She went passed the camera at about 50 mph before racing off again immediately afterwards. It is a dual carriageway with a NSL.

Back in lane 1 at 70mph I was then overtaken by her at about 90mph.

So, that is just one of many examples of why money cameras do NOT increase safety but in fact make it more dangerous.

Another example has been the long term roadworks on the M1 just south of Leicester Forrest services. A temporary but mandatory 50mph maximum limit was in force for about 2 years. I uses to slow gradually to 50mph so I was doing 50mph as I entered the restricted speed area. I used to have coaches, HGV's and everything flashing me (within the speed limit area), overtaking me, cutting in front to show how clever they were. It actually made the journey for me significantly more dangerous.

All money cameras do successfully is generate money. If you want to improve safety, re-educate drivers and moreso stop making cars that are thoughtfully restricted to 155mph!

I drive a BMW and I am no doubt the slowest BMW driver ever as I actually stick to the speed limit. Rare indeed, but as my job depends on me keeping a clean licence I do just that. In fact in 30 years of driving I have never had a single point.

[jed52]

Why did you write to Warwickshire Police when you were on the M4? The M4 doesnt go anywhere near Warwickshire. Did you mean the M40?

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by wheelergeezer

moreso stop making cars that are thoughtfully restricted to 155mph!

I drive a BMW and I am no doubt the slowest BMW driver ever as I actually stick to the speed limit. Rare indeed, but as my job depends on me keeping a clean licence I do just that. In fact in 30 years of driving I have never had a single point.

In the home country for your car there arr many miles of motorway where it is perfectly safe and legal to do 155 mph plus. I have, before now, driven a 7 series at over 130 mph on the cruise control.

The 155 mph limiter is a 'gentleman's agreement between the German car makers and the German government - it has no basis is German law. You will note however, that two VW group subsidiaries ignore this agreement (Bugatti and Lamborghini)

[wheelergeezer]

Oh, I agree 100% Pat. I used to work for Jack barclays in London where we sold Bentley Turbo R's that were verry capable of 150mph +.

It just doesn't make sense to make cars for the general public that are capable of such speeds IMHO.

[Conniff]

Originally Posted by wheelergeezer

Oh, I agree 100% Pat. I used to work for Jack barclays in London where we sold Bentley Turbo R's that were verry capable of 150mph +.

It just doesn't make sense to make cars for the general public that are capable of such speeds IMHO.

And this is so easy to do now with modern cars having computers that control everything. As long as it was a speed controller and not a 'rev' limiter, which can be dangerous.

[Danny54]

Originally Posted by jed52

Why did you write to Warwickshire Police when you were on the M4? The M4 doesnt go anywhere near Warwickshire. Did you mean the M40?

Yes, my typing mistake, I actually meant junction 4 of the M6, not M4. Doh!

[postggj]

rubish

[crem]

Originally Posted by wheelergeezer

Another example has been the long term roadworks on the M1 just south of Leicester Forrest services. A temporary but mandatory 50mph maximum limit was in force for about 2 years. I uses to slow gradually to 50mph so I was doing 50mph as I entered the restricted speed area. I used to have coaches, HGV's and everything flashing me (within the speed limit area), overtaking me, cutting in front to show how clever they were. It actually made the journey for me significantly more dangerous.
I was on the M6 yesterday and suffered a similar dilema. It was late evening, quite roads and good conditions, yet I was still trying to slow to 50mph for the roadwork (with no one working at them of course). I felt much more vunerable and dangerous than if I had kept up to the speed of the (few) other vehicles on the road.

All money cameras do successfully is generate money. If you want to improve safety, re-educate drivers and moreso stop making cars that are thoughtfully restricted to 155mph!
I agree, although I might not go as far as agreeing 155mph is safe for 90% of our drivers to drive at!

I drive a BMW and I am no doubt the slowest BMW driver ever as I actually stick to the speed limit. Rare indeed, but as my job depends on me keeping a clean licence I do just that. In fact in 30 years of driving I have never had a single point.
io! I think I am the slowest BMW driver unfortunately for the same reason. Although I must admit I haven't had a clean license for 30 years, only 25

..

[Danny54]

Originally Posted by postggj

rubish

..is how you spelled that word.

[wheelergeezer]

Crem, you and I are both driving instructors I suspect.

I wasn't agreeing that 155mph is ok. I was being sarcastic with the use of the word 'thoughtfully'. 160mph too fast. 155mph. Thats better. Ridiculous isn't it?

[Yellow160]

just a question! if you knew the (Temp) speed limit was 50mph with average speed cameras in place then why proceed to drive 10mph over that limit?

[gwc1000]

Originally Posted by wheelergeezer

Completely disagree. Money (Speed) cameras simply cause bad drivers to suddenly brake for the camera and then immediately speed up afterwards.

Surely this a case of bad driving. The camera cannot be blamed for this, only the driver. It must follow that if there was no camera the driver would continue exceeding the speed limit. This cannot be condoned.
Near us we have a temporary 40mph in a normal 70mph for a couple of miles due to roadworks. It seems that most people consider that this limit does not apply to them and continue at 70mph, and then consider themselves hard done by when they are pulled over. I have no sympathy.

[crem]

Originally Posted by gwc1000

Near us we have a temporary 40mph in a normal 70mph for a couple of miles due to roadworks. It seems that most people consider that this limit does not apply to them and continue at 70mph, and then consider themselves hard done by when they are pulled over. I have no sympathy.

..and 90% of the time a 40mph restriction will be completely unnecessary.